Girlfriend Pays Debt

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Girlfriend Pays Debt
Seeking advice: Girlfriend has a lot of debt, I don't. What should I do?
Seeking advice: Girlfriend has a lot of debt, I don't. What should I do?
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We had a huge fight last night about money. For the first time in 1.5 years, we fought about money. I'm 25. My girlfriend is 29.
I'm not worried about my girlfriends student loans, or car payment, etc. Those things, to me, are necessities in life. Hell, I have a motorcycle payment which isn't even a necessity... but I can afford it. My girlfriend in credit card debt, has somewhere around 8-10k.
The 8-10k is mostly from what I call "living outside of your means" - things like going out, buying gifts, new computer, shopping, mostly, in general.
Here's the problem - My job situation suddenly became very unstable. We're nearing the end of our 1-year lease (in June) and I can't commit myself because of the job situation to move back out with my girlfriend (we were going to move to a new city; she got a new job at a top school in the country). I even had to borrow a little cash from my mom to pay rent one month (I'm back on my feet now, but I still have to pay it back) and I borrowed a little cash from my girlfriend during the rough time.
Because of this, it's been hard and we've been planning on moving back home. Our plan for the last 2+ months has been... move back home with our parents (assuming I didn't find a new job before then). She would put the money she's saving on living expenses toward shaving down her credit card debt, so we would be in a better position for our future. I would pay back the money I borrowed. I would be able to pay everything back in full within a month and a half.
Our entire relationship we've talked about future goals being: marriage, buying a house, traveling, starting that kind of life together.
Last night, she comes home from work and tells me she's decided she's going to get an apartment on her own, whether or not I can afford it. She tells me this was "good news" she was delivering. In order to do it, she said she will take a second job part time. She also said I can live with her without paying anything while I pay off the money I was given, and while I continue my schooling (finishing my BS)
She wanted my opinion, and I told her what it was: I wasn't thrilled of the idea that I wouldn't get to see her even more than I do now if she's working ANOTHER job. I said, it's not something I'd leave her over, but I would miss her. I told her, financially, my opinion was that she has such a large amount of debt it would be smarter even though we don't want to move back home... for her to take all the money she saves from living expenses like we talked about, to pay off at least a big chunk of her debt. I told her, after I returned the money I borrowed, and if she saved living expenses for 3 months she would be able to pay off nearly $4,000 of her credit debt.
We got into a huge fight because she refuses to move back home suddenly - even at the cost of putting herself in FURTHER debt. I kept saying, it's only temporary... and if we moved back for a few months, we'd both be in a much better position for our future together.
Eventually, some big things came out that rocked my world a little bit:
About 6 months ago she surprised me with $3,000 saved for a vacation we wanted to take. She said she saved it up from her second part time job she had last summer. Turns out, she lied. She took a loan for $3,000 and we ended up using it for expenses instead of traveling; and the interest rate was high, so now she'll owe nearly $5,000 to pay that back.
I was mad, and told her she couldn't continue that lifestyle forever... and what did that mean for our future together? She said she likes living this way, and she has never had an issue. She always just gets a second job, pays the debt off. Here's the part that bothers me: She says, then, she puts all the money back on the cards by shopping/buying things/going out/etc because it's "what she wants to do and she likes living this way"
I said, why not pay off your debt so you're not gaining interest, and just spend the money you have left over on your paychecks instead of putting everything on credit?
Her reply was that because then she is "limited" for instance if she only has $200 left over. I said, what happens when your credit runs out? Or we want to buy a house someday and we can't? Or we want to travel and we can't?
My feeling is that the more debt she accrues, the further we get from our goals. Her feeling is, word-for-word "I can get in debt as a young person doing the things I want to do, and pay it off later"
What exactly am I supposed to do here? She's very upset and thinks I'm "lecturing" her about money and how to use it - she says, it's her money, and none of my fucking business how she uses it.
I have always agreed, but I feel like we've been together and lived together long enough that it's kind of time to shit or get off the pot - are we going to progress to the next stage in our lives, and HOW are we going to do that? Unfortunately; money DOES play a role in those things.
Currently be glad it's only her credit this affects. You know she's making bad decisions but right now isn't feeling any real consequences.
When I met my wife she was juggling a few credit cards (department ones) and lamenting she never seemed to be saving money. I made a spreadsheet she could follow and pay them off. She did so. And honestly, at her age (26 at the time) I wanted to make sure I wasn't starting to date a girl who couldn't manage her money with the proper plan.
Doesn't sound like your gf is in a place to want to listen to advice though. So while you may be limited in what you can advise, you AREN'T limited in what you do yourself.
I'd suggest continuing with your own goals and plans...even if that means not living with her (as I think this'd be a recipe for money even coming more to the forefront) and while she'll let you live rent free for now...who knows what debt she'll accrue that she'll expect you to help pay with in arrears?
Part of the argument we had was about me taking on that debt someday (marriage). Because... yeah, I don't particularly want it. Actually, it's not even the debt - it's the lifestyle. I don't want my future wife someday racking up credit card debt we can't pay off when it's for things we don't need. That's a lot coming from me, because I have a taste for finer things in life and I do love spending - but when I can afford it. If not, I'm not above eating shit for a while to get there.
She said if our finances were combined, she would have to consider me before making purchases (meaning, ask me, since we'd have a joint account) and she would have to basically stop doing those things and she claims she would. However, she says, as it is now, it's her money and she does what she wants with it because she doesn't have to think about anyone else.
I told her whether it's me or any other future boyfriend or husband, it's very short sighted to think that way. Her financial decisions now will affect her future; and her future partner.
Her response was basically "I was like this before you, and I've always been fine- and I'll be like this in the future whether you're there or not."
Ok, well you're both financial disasters but at least you know what's going on and care about it. She does not seem to understand or even give a fuck. Hey look a new shiny purse! And no it's not "her money" if you guys are a couple. That never works, trust me.
If that's the case, and there's no making her even talk about. Get the fuck out. Get out now.
Ugh-this is actually pretty alarming. She is perfectly happy and willing to live above her means-even if it means wracking up debt to to the tune of $10000. In another year it could be $20000. Her priorities are whack-she won't even live at home for 4 or 5 months to pay of her debt and save money?
Id make a last ditch effort to tell her how disturbing this is to you when you think about trying to make plans for a future together. ASk her if she would be willing to do a budget where you both put so much money into retiring debt and into savings-after that its up to each of you how you spend your money.
"if we can't agree on an adult budget together we can't live together"
Look at her-she is 30 and she is acting like an impulsive 19 year old where spending is concerned
The biggest cause of marriage (or boyfriend/girlfriend) separation is money fights. I assure you this relationship will not last if the two parties think so differently about money.
So I would go to a personal finance class or program and both of you get on the same page regarding debt and spending.
Not pushing Dave Ramsey but that is the best program I can think of. My suggestion is go check out from the library (or buy because only about $10 or $15) the book "The Total Money Makeover". You read it and then she reads it. Then have a heart to heart talk. If you both can't get on the same page then time to move on. And I don't mean that in a mean way but if you are already fighting about money and not married yet there isn't a chance this relationship will succeed.
So see if you and your girlfriend can "get on the same page". I hope so because with the right approach on money and debt you both can have a very successful life. But if you can't agree on money, debt, and spending now it can't work.
Maybe, I will try this... but after the water settles for a bit. My GF is pretty hot headed; if I bring this up now, she's definitely going to say I'm just trying to teach her something, or lecture her, or whatever and get mad about it.
The fact that she is continuing bad habits despite your input really doesn't bode well for her future and your relationship going forward. Financial irresponsibility is a huge dealbreaker for me, and that kind of behavior would raise giant red flags, so I'm a little biased in this case. You can only do so much to advise someone who is unwilling to listen. But how is she totally ok with the idea that she'll be saddling you with consequences of her selfish decisions should you actually decide to marry her? Does she understand how that will affect you as a couple? Disagreements in finances are one of the major areas which lead to failed marriages/relationships.
Regardless of the relationship, is she even aware of how that will affect her own future in terms of credit score and crushing debt with all that accumulating interest? Is she expecting some kind of windfall bail out? She's 29 years old; is she even thinking about savings or how she'll support herself down the line past working age?
And not to berate you, but what are you doing with a motorcycle payment when you are borrowing money from your mom and girlfriend to make rent? It doesn't sound like you can really afford that either.
I agree with your sentiments. It's exactly what I told her.
I bought my motorcycle a long time ago, long before I had any financial situation arise. I considered selling it, but I basically owe close to what I would get at market value since it's a little older now. My monthly payments are incredibly low (for a bike) and I actually can afford it. It's always been kind of a drop in the bucket compared to anything else; and I've never touched credit to pay it. Always straight from my bank.
I borrowed money for rent; which was a lot more expensive. I can pay it back really quick, in fact I already saved enough to pay half of my debt.
Ask her why she can't get the second job first and then take a vacation -- I think the answer would be telling. 20s are a great decade to waste money in, but her friendliness with debt is troubling.


In Other Words: “My Girlfriend Is $170k In Debt And Didn’t Even Know”


By: Dear Wendy


February 4, 2016

Columns ,
In Other Words (Letters from other advice columns)


39 comments

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Last night I found out that she has $90k more debt than I thought —$170k total. I found out this information from the bank’s loan application, not from her. I asked her countless times to sort out all of her debt and to figure out who she owes and how much so we can make a plan for a future. Wedding, children, schools, house, etc.. So, I developed a ten year plan to pay off our loans, buy a house, save for children’s future. Now with this new debt, we can’t pay her stuff off for twenty years.
Her lack of knowledge about her finances comes from laziness and apathy, not malice. She didn’t lie on purpose. She simply never bothered to do what she needed to do to make a plan. I’m pissed. I don’t know if I want to commit another ten years of my life to paying off her education, especially when now we can’t afford a house. I want vacations. I want a car. I want furniture. I want to go out to dinner sometimes. I want a wedding. I want college funds for my children. I don’t see any of this happening now. What should I do? — Fiancé Finance Fiasco
I thought Dan Savage’s quickie response to this letter was pretty dismissive and that the situation isn’t as black-and-white as his reply would indicate. Of course, if the LW thinks about it and decides that obtaining a certain lifestyle — a nice house, furnishings, a car, kids, vacations, etc., — as quickly as possible is more important than whom he shares those things with, then he should probably MOA. But maybe, just maybe , this letter, written one day after the LW discovered from the bank that his girlfriend of six years had 90K more debt than he knew of reflected a moment of panic and utter disappointment and not the entirety of his feelings for his girlfriend. Maybe the disappointment — and sheer shock — the LW feels isn’t so much over the sudden change in his plans for the future and the “game-of-life crap,” as Dan Savage calls a house and kids and cars and vacations, but in discovering that the woman he hoped to enjoy those things with in the near future is, at best, far more financially irresponsible than he imagined and, at worse, potentially dishonest. These are all big blows to deal with and it’s understandable that, on day two of processing them, the LW may not be singing the praises of his girlfriend and swearing to stand by her side no matter what.
LW, if you’re reading this, I suggest you put the house-buying on hold and instead make an appointment for you and your girlfriend with a financial advisor. With the help of a professional, you may learn that what you believe is now a 20-year plan to pay off your girlfriend’s debt can be reduced considerably, maybe even without sacrificing too much of the game-of-life stuff you’re dreaming of. Once you have your financial ducks more in a row, you can do some soul-searching about what is most important to you.
Dan Savage is right that if a timetable for obtaining stuff matters more to you than whom you share those things with, then the answer about what to do is obvious. Unlike Dan, I suspect, though, that despite writing in for advice — again, one day after getting the blow that your girlfriend, with whom you were about to buy a house, has 170K of debt — you have not settled on the answer and that such an answer doesn’t seem as easy as deciding what’s important to you. And that’s because you are now in the unenviable position of trying to figure out if your girlfriend is who you thought she was. You have to decide, with this new information, not whether you love her or she means a lot to you, but whether she’s lifelong-partner material. You thought she was. Does 90k change that? Does knowing that she has a history of financial irresponsibility change that? You know that what the future you dreamed of with her looks a little different now. Can you still envision a happy future with her? If not, then you know your answer.
What might be a trickier question is whether you can envision a happy future with someone else. Are you willing to leave your girlfriend, whose flaws you know, for the chance to build a different future with someone else, whose flaws you don’t yet know? We all have our debt, metaphorically speaking. The key is to find someone whose debt we can can deal with and who can deal with the debt we carry. Maybe it IS pretty black-and-white, after all.
In his column, Dan Savage posed a question to his readers and I’ll ask you all the same: Would you rather find out that your partner cheated on you or that he or she was 170k in debt?
Follow along on Facebook, and Instagram .
If you have a relationship/dating question I can help answer, you can send me your letters at wendy@dearwendy.com .
Same answer I gave on the original – cheating for sure! That level of non-mortgage debt – especially like this where it’s either due to financial irresponsibility or lying – is a deal breaker.
ETA: I should say, a marriage deal breaker, though not necessarily a dating-but-not-looking-for-marriage deal breaker.

wobster109
February 4, 2016, 1:41 pm

I’d prefer the cheating, if it’s a one-time thing! I’d get over a one-time affair faster than paying off 170k. But a string
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